Frequently Assaulted Quotes

Catholicism

• Purgatory quote #1: "But the idea of purgation, of cleansing as by fire seems to me inseparable from what the Bible teaches us of the Divine chastisements" (Life and Letters of Hort, Vol II., pg 336).

• Praying quote #1: "We agreed unanimously that we are, as things are now, forbidden to pray for the dead apart from the whole church in our public services. No restriction is placed upon private devotions (to pray for the dead)." (Life and Letters of Hort, Vol II., pg 349).

Purgatory quote #1: "But the idea of purgation, of cleansing as by fire seems to me inseparable from what the Bible teaches us of the Divine chastisements" (Life and Letters of Hort, Vol II., pg 336).

This quote is ripped entirely out of context, and is intended to make people think Hort believed in Purgatory. The full quote shows Hort is entirely opposed to Purgatory. I can only assume that whoever originally dug out this quote is either entirely incompetent or intentionally deceptive (I suspect the latter). This quote was part of a response letter to an undergrad student named H. Brinton, who had written to Hort (this was in 1886, when Hort was older and a well-known and well-respected author, preacher, and professor) asking him some questions about the Thirty-nine Articles which the Anglicans (and thus Hort) accept (the full Thirty-nine Articles can be read at the BELIEVE Religious Information Source and other places on the internet). The quote in question is in regards to Article XXII, which in entirety reads:

"The Romish doctrine concerning Pugatory, Pardons, worshipping and adoration as well of Images as of Relics, and also Invocation of Saint, is a fond thing vainly invented, and grounded upon no warranty of Scripture; but rather repugnant to the word of God."

The surrounding text of Hort's words are as follows (quote is bolded, relevant information is underlined):

"'Purgatory' is not a word that I should myself spontaneously adopt, because it is associated with Roman theories about the future state for which I see no foundation . But the idea of purgation, of cleansing as by fire seems to me inseparable from what the Bible teaches us of the Divine chastisements and, though little is directly said respecting the future state, it seems to me incredible that the Divine chastisements should in this respect change their character when this visible life is ended. Neither now nor hereafter is there reason to suppose that they act mechanically as by an irresistible natural process, irrespectively of hurnan will and acceptance. But I do not believe that God's purposes of love can ever cease towards us in any stage of our existence, or that they can accomplish themselves by our purification and perfection without painful processes. It has been well said that the heaviest sentence which could be pronounced on a sinful man would be, "Let him alone."
     Hence, while the language of the Article does not appear to me at all too strong in condemnation of the Roman doctrine of purgatory, involving as that does very mischievous superstitions, I do not hold it contrary to the Article to think that the condemned doctrine has not been wholly injurous, inasmuch as it has kept alive some sort of belief in a great and important truth. - F.J.A.H."

Hort did NOT believe in Purgatory, as the original quote tries to convey, and in fact makes several strong statements against it. He was merely commenting on the general principle of chastisement.

Praying quote #1: "We agreed unanimously that we are, as things are now, forbidden to pray for the dead apart from the whole church in our public services. No restriction is placed upon private devotions (to pray for the dead)." (Life and Letters of Hort, Vol II., pg 349).

This quote comes from a private letter "to a clergyman". Westcott did NOT believe in prayers for the dead in the Catholic sense, but due to a recent controversy (as explained in the full quote below) Westcott was commenting on what the official stance of the (Anglican) church was (italics in original, quote bolded, relevant text underlined):

"     My attention has been called to two notices in the Parish Magazine for August, p. ii : (1) that the Holy Eucharist will be specially offered on behalf [of the Christians massacred in China]; and again, (2) that the Holy Eucharist will be offered on behalf (of the Rev.----).      You know, I am sure, that I am most anxious not to abridge in the least degree the liberty which our Church allows to her children ; but I cannot doubt that the thought conveyed, naturally, by the worlds which I have underlined is alien from her teaching . It is possible to put a meaning up them which can be reconciled with Anglican doctrine, but they cannot fail, in my opinion, both to mislead and to cause serious trouble to very many.      When present controversies threatened to become serious, I considered very carefully, in conference with some other bishops of large knowledge and experience, the attitude of our Church with regard to prayers for the Dead. We agreed unanimously that we are, as things are now, forbidden to pray for the Dead apart from the whole Church in our public Services. No restriction is placed upon private devotions. The language is "with them we," "we and all Thy Church," "we with all those that are..." It is therefore, as far as I can judge, allowable to make a pause in the Prayer for the Church Millitant, when the congregation can remember those who are "in Christ". The subject is indeed one of greatest obscurity, and where Scripture is silent it is perilous to theorise. In fact, all that we know is summed up in the words "in Christ." In that unity there is an effective fellowship of life.      I shall, of course, be ready to consider anything you may wish to say upon the subject, but I do not think that I have overlooked any point affecting the position of our own Church now. Have you used the phrase for any time? I have never noticed it before.
     May God in His infinite love bring us all into unity ἐν χῶ"

Westcott did not believe in prayers specificially to/for the dead, but did recognize that phrases like "we and all Thy Church" were not necessarily restricted to the Church Millitant (the church members still alive on earth, as opposed to the Church Triumphant, the church members dead and with Christ in heaven). In public, the Church forbid prayer to/for the dead except in vague phrases like that. He also recognized the Church had no control (and thus could not restrict) what was said in prayers by individiuals in their devotions.